2Dof + Traction Loss JRK/Worm Motors Sim

Awesome! Thanks guys! I'll give that a shot, sounds like that's the cause of my problems!
Sorry for asking what had already been explained, bsfts post didn't come up on my screen when I refreshed it before.

If I were to change my gearboxes to the 50 or 60:1 would I have to change my sim tools and jrk settings again dramatically?

@Shadow041 This is what I did and no problems.
In game Engine/ Interface settings / Shutdown Output..... Change the 255 to 221 on both axis. The 255 command turns the power off to the motors and if they're easily backdriven such as the 25/1 motors are likely such as in your case to sink below the mid position, until the next game triggers a 221 and voila they spring back to life. This means after the initial game triggers them, they will stay centered between games until manualy switched off. I,ve had no overheating troubles with the motors being on in up to 4/5 hour sessions, so I think current draw maintaing centre must be negligible. Try it and see, saves flopping between games, don't alter your COG setting!!!

Ok so i spent this afternoon tuning the sim as per your recommendations of trying not to exceed the 100%. so my new values are:
Roll, Pitch, Heave and Surge all at 20% with Sway at 30%
In tuning Center:
Roll 1,-1
Pitch 1.3,-1.3
Heave 1.2,-1.2
Sway 0.7, -0.7
Surge 1.3, -0.9

I had to increase the sway percentage as i couldn't get it to feel right just by tuning center, and it still doesn't, it seemed that if i had a larger number the motion was smoother but wouldn't move very far and if i had a low number it would be very sharp and snappy and move a bit further but not as much as i'd like, and the only way to have it move more was to drive the % up...

The sim now has a very different feel to it too. Its very sharp and aggressive, to the point that when i drove the F3000 at imola i thought i was in an earthquake sim!, and i feel it has lost some of its realism. Side note: definitely need to make proper feet for the sim to sit on, lockable castors, no matter how good, dont seem to be able to stand up to the crazy motion those motors can produce! I could feel the whole sim wobbling on the rough track!

So im not too sure how to fix this... I did drop those values on the JRKs down to 500 for max duty cycle and acceleration and the current calibration to 120 after changing everything but didn't notice much of a difference..
I am glad to report though that the protocol errors i was getting has disappeared! i spent a few hours on it this arvo and didn't get a single one! However motor dropouts were up.. haha fix one thing and something else happens..

Oh and i found where i got the original idea of running the higher percentages.. http://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/2dof-jrk-seat-mover-big-worm-gears.4898/
And i think i had read somewhere that one suggested way to tune was to just capture the max min then adjust the % to suit, but it seems this is very wrong for my sim...

I believe @bsft asked what power supplies i have. I'm running one HP DL380 G4 575 w per motor wired up according to the guide in the FAQ section.. As far as i can tell they are new power supplies they did come with fresh user manuals and packaging, i did dismantle one to inspect for dust etc and couldnt find anything, these are the ones i bought; http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HP-PROLI...-355892-B21-/360202297511?hash=item53ddbae0a7

I have wondered if putting a battery or capacitor in parallel with the PSU would help reduce the spikes that the PSU seems to be reacting to.. Has anyone done this before?

On the gear ratio front, im thinking i might change to the 50 or 60:1 boxes at some point.. however i will try @Rastus's suggestion first.
Also I'm guessing im definitely going to need one for the traction loss motor, not sure how the 25:1 would handle a 200mm lever arm even if it is as far back as i can get it! Is this something thats doable? i have seen other guys having chain drives or higher powered motors for the traction loss, am i able to get away with one of these 200W motors and a 50/60:1 box?

yes you can just buy 50/60:1 boxes and fit them to the motors.
Good to see profiles are sorted. Not sure on motor dropouts, maybe wind the power down a bit at a time.
I have used a car batter before working with a cheap PSU for charging it. It might solve it, give it a go, see if you can hunt up a 300CCA car battery.

Any suggestion on how to make the profile smoother and bring more movement into the sway axis?
When you say wind the power down, do you mean drop the max acceleration and duty cycle values?

I'll definitely give the parallel battery a go, guess it cant really hurt it!

Is there a preferable ratio to go for for the traction loss and seat motors? or does this come back to calculating the velocity of the movement relative to the arm length and trying to aim for that 300-400 meters per minute...

You can run your total percentages up to 120%, but you might get drop outs, hard to say.
Yes I mean drop max accel and max duty, but try reducing max duty cycle a bit first.
As for bringing more movement on sway, not much reduce tuning centre number Id say and add a bit more force on percentage
as for traction loss @Nick Moxley , can you help here please?
Oh, I had another look at the photos of your sim, you could always bring the arms connecting to the back of the seat in a bit, yes its fabrication, but thats an immediate increase in sway.
I need to do the same with my sim

Im confused, dont you already have traction loss built onto your rig ?

Cool, ill try reducing those values and see if it helps. I also just ordered 2 of these in the hope that ill be able to monitor the voltage and current draw to figure out whats causing the cut outs.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/251716006985?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

Just out of curiosity more than anything, looking back at that link, how was it that hyper1966 was able to run so far about the 100% and not have problems?

I didnt realise that reducing the spacing between the mount points on the seat would increase sway.. might give that a go, not sure how far ill be able to move it though as the connecting rods might start to hit things at that angle... we shall see! I did just order some of those misalignment spacer things though to hopefully allow for more range of movement and less potential binding on the joints..

@Nick Moxley i do have it installed in a physical sense but i havent had time yet to connect up the control gear, still have some soldering to do so its never moved... It currently has a 200mm CTC lever on a 25:1 box mounted as far back as i could and the front is pivoted on a lazy susan bearing. Will this actually move the sim or could i overload/damage the motor/jrk/psu? What ratio worm drive would i be better off with?

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Silver-T...aring-5-Pcs-/331623435033?hash=item4d364c0b19
also ive got these currently supporting the upper frame for it to roll on when the traction loss kicks in, not sure how good theyll be. I'm planning on hitting them up with a fair bit of hitemp grease that i use on my kart. Has anyone else used these type of rollers?

your 25:1 will be more than enough to move the traction loss, Im 1/2 on the fence of wanting to try a 50:1 on my traction loss But haven't gotten around to it. I am however on a 100mm lever, Questioning if 200 might be a little much, What kind of travel do you have built into the TL ?

Most use Castor's for the quality bearing's they offer and the weight rating as well. I questioned another user trying those balls in the past and im not too sure how it turned out, but if anything you can retrofit some Castor's if those balls dont end up working.

Can you let us know where you found your motors? Ive been looking for a reliable place to buy these....

Hi guys, sorry its taken me a while to get back here. im sure you all know what its like juggling hobbies and work.
@Nick Moxley i have finally got the traction loss working, i thought id made a 200mm lever but turns out it was only 100mm! the traction loss work brilliantly and as for those little roller ball supports, so far i havent had any problems with them, however i am planning on hitting them up with some high temp grease next time i have the rig apart..

i have come across another fun issue while tuning assetto corsa, it only happens sometimes and usually if i hit something hard but game engine loses connection to the com ports and crashes. the controllers themselves dont spit out any errors or flash or anything but it forces me to restart. Ive tried closing everything and opening again but game engine wont recognise that they are connected... Any ideas?

Also i did manage to fix those controller drop out issue i was having by putting in a powered hub where my controllers sit and use one of the usb lead that i use to run to the controller to feed it (about 3-4m)
That issue i described above does have the same fix of disconnecting and reconnecting the usb but its the first time game engine has crashed when its happened!

I did give that a go and it didnt seem to change. Just found out that project cars is having the same issue.. Im now starting to wonder if its related to the original dropout problem but that somehow the powered usb hub is stopping the controllers from locking up and is instead crashing game engine..

Going to test this soon when i get a longer hdmi lead form work so i can move the pc to the rear of the sim.

Also noticed that my right motor and controller get substantially hotter than the others... i have wondered if its related to the fact that sometimes that motor has issues when it drops down low in its arc, it seems to judder back and forth for a few seconds before it picks up again...

I read somewhere about gas dampers supporting part of the sim, would this help? going to try and find where i read that...

Oh and i will be doing a video at some point, just want to get some of these issues ironed out first so it doesn't cut out halfway!! haha

Is the sim balanced properly?
Have you made any changes to motor settings or PID?
Maybe you might need a higher D number on that motor.

Right hand side runs warmer on 98% of our Rigs. Its partially due to the Braking pressure your applying which is also Pressing back on the motor forcing the motor to work that much harder. The "Drop below its arc" is also related to the Brake pressure your applying. As you come into a Heavy braking stage your rig is constantly trying to re adjust its position. As you Step on the brake heavily enough you will actually catch the motor in a position change and Over power the motor and push it to a position where the motor can "catch it" again and thats where the shudder comes from, Its the motor TRYING to get back to its known position it wants to be in.

The sim should be balanced properly, i rebalanced it when i upgraded the uni joint but am considering moving it back slightly to accommodate heavy brake pressure... I havent changed any of the PID setting, all the motors are set the same if i remember correctly. Might try a higher D setting at your suggestion though, see if it helps. Is the D setting the one that governs the motors ability to overthrow?

Also just finished another round of testing and have found that i have pretty much solved most of my software and JRK problems by moving my PC to the rear of the sim and running 75cm usb cables directly from the JRKs to the PC. Ran the sim for about an hour pretty hard and couldn't manage to crash game engine or lock up a controller!! Hooray!! Who would have thought JRKs dont like 3m USB leads or powered hubs...

So now i can focus a bit more on the structure of the sim again and start building a new location for the PC as well as strengthening (and possibly redesigning) the front end pedal area as i noticed i had a fair bit of flex when standing on the brakes... Oh not sure if i mentioned i put a GT EYE progressive brake spring in. strong but feels pretty good.