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How to use this Joystick plugin with YAWVR

Discussion in 'Commercial Simulators and Peripherie' started by Kazpet, Oct 3, 2020.

  1. Kazpet

    Kazpet New Member

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    Can someone please direct me to where the instructions are on how to use this Joystick plugin with YAWVR
    Kazpet, Oct 3, 2020
    #1
  2. paulopsx2

    paulopsx2 Active Member

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    No "instructions". Plugin is the same for ALL platforms. The best way to make great movements, is sitting on yawvr, so move the joystick all over the place to find the positions that are best for you. for each side you place make a change in simtools. ( Remember only two ways appears, no pitch or roll ).
    paulopsx2, Oct 3, 2020
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  3. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    YAWVR are the ones responsible for instructions specifically related to their product.

    Alternatively you could rephrase to ask if any existing YAWVR owners can provide specific advice about configuring and using the Joystick plugin.

    Failing that grab a copy of the SimTools manual: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/faq/rtfm-start-with-the-official-simtools-documentation.117/

    And see the FAQ tips on how to refine a motion profile: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/faq/steps-to-create-a-motion-profile.228/
    noorbeast, Oct 4, 2020
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  4. KydDynoMyte

    KydDynoMyte Fool's Gold Contributor

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    I haven't tuned it yet, but this is a good start for:
    YawVR Limits set to FrontPitch:12 BackPitch:15 Roll:15 Yaw Limited: 15

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    KydDynoMyte, Oct 5, 2020
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  5. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    I have not used a YawVR, so just some generic comments, I will presume the rig moves as expected in Output Testing, though you should confirm that given the posted images:

    Min/Max values need capturing in the Tuning Center, see the previously mentioned FAQ tips on how to refine a motion profile: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/faq/steps-to-create-a-motion-profile.228/

    Why the Axis Limiting, normally you would only use that where there was a risk of overshoot that breaks something, like on SCN actuators.

    I don't know how the YawVR motors are configured, and hence what is needed for Axis Assignments, but this is what SimTools expects: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/faq/which-way-to-set-simtool-axis-movements.230/
    noorbeast, Oct 5, 2020
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  6. KydDynoMyte

    KydDynoMyte Fool's Gold Contributor

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    The forces are a little jumbled up in the joystick plugin. That's what I got with my x52pro.

    They were captured. I increased the max on Heave(Throttle) so the rig would be level at zero throttle.

    Those Simtools axis limits are matched to the YawVR axis limits I mentioned it was set for. You should adjust the simtools limits to match the YawVR ones as close as possible without going over. YawVR assumes 360° on all 3 axes. This is where most people go wrong in setting it up with Simtools.

    The 3 motors are in a 120° pattern using omni wheels that move the upper part like a 3 omniwheel robot. There are 3 virtual axes: pitch, roll, & yaw, that are handled with the YawVR software.
    KydDynoMyte, Oct 5, 2020
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  7. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    If that is YawVR advice then go with that in terms of axis limiting.
    noorbeast, Oct 5, 2020
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  8. KydDynoMyte

    KydDynoMyte Fool's Gold Contributor

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    It's just KydDynoMyte advice. I haven't heard or seen anything official from YawVR on how to setup Simtools axis limiting.
    KydDynoMyte, Oct 6, 2020
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  9. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    What official advice do YawVR give about setting up their product?

    I would expect you want the full range of motion available on pitch and roll at the very least, hence I would question the Axis Limiting. Yaw is a bit more questionable, as it relates to the design of the rig and intended use, but generally yaw does not greatly relate to cars, unless they are in a spin, it does relate to flight but in a constrained way, and is more applicable to a helicopter.
    noorbeast, Oct 6, 2020
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  10. KydDynoMyte

    KydDynoMyte Fool's Gold Contributor

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    YawVR has their own motion software that works pretty good and very configurable but limited supported games for now.

    Their is another motion software very similar to simtools that added YawVR support and takes care of the initial setup and has people making tuned profiles for them. But they don't support many games that need memory mapped plugins.

    The 8% in Simtools axis limiting gives you 360°x8%=28.8° of travel. A 15 in Yaw VR limits is 15° on each side of origin before it starts ignoring data. So 28.8° is as close we can get to 30° without going past it. You can set it much higher or lower, but for someone just starting out 20° - 30° is plenty until they know what they are doing.

    The yaw axis can be very tricky in the Yaw VR. You can limit it or not limit it. The joystick plugins in all the motion software seem to currently just map the travel of the stick so unlimited yaw doesn't work so good. Unlimited yaw works best with angle/heading data. Someone could make a little bit of code to change the yaw on the joystick plugins from absolute to relative so we could use unlimted 360°. Feedback seems to be, a lot of yaw feels great in any game. Currently, using lighthouse is the only motion cancellation solution not having any yaw drift for us Yaw VR users.
    KydDynoMyte, Oct 6, 2020
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  11. noorbeast

    noorbeast VR Tassie Devil Staff Member Moderator Race Director

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    I can't comment on or draw any conclusion from other software, rather I am trying to give insight into SimTools and why it is configured certain ways for particular outcomes.

    I am also talking about yaw as a simulation motion cue, not a design parameter and feature of a particular rig. A motion arcade with wild axis movements can be fun, but that does not mean it is accurate in terms of motion simulation.

    The SimTools manual is here and should be kept handy for reference: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/faq/rtfm-start-with-the-official-simtools-documentation.117/

    A brief summary of how SimTools work is to take and axis, say pitch. Now a rig like a 2DOF, or YawVR, will have an absolute mechanically imposed pitch range and for SimTools the total of that range is 100%. But you are not limited to using the pitch axis for just pitch, a portion of the pitch range can be assigned to pitch, surge and heave, which is what the Axis Assignment section is for, with the total allocation to be around 100%, SimTools will mix and manage those Axis Allocations on the fly. For example SimTools can have pitch up input to simulate going up a hill, while at the same time mix in surge to simulate acceleration up that hill, plus give a kick to simulate a gear change at the same time, all using the pitch axis.

    Heave would normally have a relatively small Axis Allocation, as it does not take much range to simulate heave, you normally would also have low Tuning Center values on heave, for some games even less than 1. Pitch itself would have a larger Axis Allocation and larger Tuning Center values, as you want smooth undulating motion through the axis allocation, which will now be a portion of the total axis range availability. Finally surge would normally have a bit more Axis Allocation than heave, but a bit less than pitch, and can be configured with a bigger Min than Max value in the Tuning Center to also simulate gear change kicks: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/faq/snappy-gear-change-motion.121/

    I am simplifying a bit but you can think of Axis Limiting as imposing a form of clipping on a axis range, much like with a FFB wheel. It is very useful for safety reasons, where something may get broken at the edge of a range, like SCN actuators. It can also be used in tuning, but, much like SimTools filters, only after the fundamentals of SimTools are taken into consideration.
    noorbeast, Oct 6, 2020
    #11
  12. KydDynoMyte

    KydDynoMyte Fool's Gold Contributor

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    Preaching to the choir. It so hard to get people to understand that. I try. The simtools limiting is a 2nd redundant safety precaution for the YawVR. But must be set properly so the game data scales properly over the expected travel and the axis assignment percentages make sense. Most people would leave Simtools limits at 100%, then hunt and peck at axis assignments until things felt good.
    KydDynoMyte, Oct 6, 2020
    #12