Peter`s MULTI SIM PROJECT

That is weld by standard gas welder - i think that everybody is using it for aluminum. It is no chance with electric or gas less one.

To give some point of subject for everyone on site i will put some of yours PM if you wouldn`t mind.

Skaut:
Thats great - actually i have a lot of ideas how to improve this platform and i can say - this is so easy with everything when i got it made in this shape.

Video will be soon - just waiting for camera.
About money you can read on the last post (second page) of Multi Sim thread.

Before you will start looking for someone who can weld it for you - check on sirnonames simulator in his gallery. He used a timber instead of steel. Maybe that is easier to do even by someone who is not a carpenter. Definitely it is easier to make everything fit together. I must say - it is pain in the ass with aluminum - because of constant deformation at the time of welding and when you using it.

razzta01:

Hi! now that I checked your last post .... thx for that hint ... I know exactly what I wanted: how much it may cost and what I need.

I don´t like timber, I love your aluminium!

I must say - it is pain in the ass with aluminum - because of constant deformation at the time of welding and when you using it. ...oooops, it did not expect this! Regarding alum.:
-i still have to check if I can arrange soldering it at home
-how much does it weight? maybe a difficult question, but if you don´t know let me know how easy it is to move it around in your room
-i guess it is strong enough to hold all the forces while playin?

and last, 2 questions:
-i am still wondering how it feels while driving? I mean it is actually a mix between force dynamics and for example sirnoname´s cockpit, very interesting
-also wondering about a 3rd SCN5 situated below the seat, I have seen it , but can´t find what it actually offers..some hint?


Skaut:
I do not know exactly how much it weight but it is light enough to be easy for any changes or to moving it. About strength - it is devil. Sometimes i am using heavy hammer and i did not break it.

Soldering in a home it is not an option - it has to be done by professional welder. Aluminum is not easy to weld. About pain..when you using it is because it`s stuck in socket places (natural alu ability).

I do not know about other solutions - this is my first one which i drove. I can say - this is the best experience in games environment have you ever will get. Next will be only Full Virtual Reality. You just need motion from the game to get greater experience - it is all about pleasure. You feel everything from: ground surface, collision to g-force experience. That what you will get by using SCN on sim - because they are able to create that motion so great.

Third DOF is about rotation - for example when you are drifting or loosing control. It is great experience but that what others do with third Scn actuator is not worth. It has to be about full rotation, even when car is changing direction. I have some project on desk for that type of rotation - i am going to share with it when i will find some time to make nice drawings.

razzta01:
Hi again skaut! Thx for your help!

Third DOF ......... It has to be about full rotation, even when car is changing direction.
....what do you mean with full rotation?
...will you adapt your actual sim to get full rotation?

I have some project on desk for that type of rotation - i am going to share with it when i will find some time to make nice drawings.
.....Can´t wait for looking at your project! ... maybe I follow your idea :thbup:

What is the difference from your type of sim and the one from user txus (simtxus-motion-simulator-t1446.html)? I can see his sim is moving a lot around the axes, but does it mean he gets more reality while driving?

Skaut:

Full rotation means that you are able to do exactly the same way that your virtual car is doing at the moment. With actual third DOF you are just getting some kind of feeling, sort move to left or right side of your back and nothing after that even when yours car is spinning around. My point is to put actual platform on some kind of rotation stage and make it moves exactly like it is in the game - if i am turning 180 degrees than my platform is going 180 degrees.

Different between the to projects is of course construction which in my opinion is better one for flight simulator because of wider angle of movements. For race simulation you do not need that kind of wide movements, even more they are pretty annoying, not very accurate with reality. You have to decide which one is yours favorite one - Race one or Flight Sim.

razzta01:

Hi skaudt! sorry, but I just discovered today your post Multi Sim version 1...
Full rotation.........and make it moves exactly like it is in the game - if i am turning 180 degrees than my platform is going 180 degrees....OH MY GOD, THIS SOUNDS INCREDIBLE ....keep on going...i will see you in the official post

Hi skaudt69!

I checked that the sockets from the movable arm´s (of the seat frame) are open on the upper part of the edges, why did you not use a socket with all 4 sides? I guess : opposite shape keeps everything strong.

Can you post some pics of: bottom frame ... Back, adjustable part (bottom of scn5 hold) - 2x250 mm with 300 mm pipe inside ..from a different angle and below?

Any new idea for pedals? Maybe something like you did for wheel?

Rgds.

For the socket it is the only material shape which i was able to find and which perfect fits with smaller square profile (no chance to find square one to fit smaller square inside without loose). Every socket is made in different way. Some of them keep other parts without any additional mountings but another, like those at the back (you mentioned) are or will be screwed down. I will put some additional pictures in to my gallery.

Pedals are actually in great shape and works great. I am not thinking about any changes to them right now. There is so many improvements which i wanna make - that will be waste of time to keep an eye on something what already is sorted, just because of : for example better look.

I will start making some movies to show you all how actually everything works. After that i will make some drawings of my future plans. This way someone with more time than i have right now just can start to develop it. I think that will be the best way to quickly understand how useful they are (since i ain`t got any experience with them - just i am going to give it a try).

ok, I will wait for the movies and the new drawings

Hi skaudt!

Just a few questions:

(1)the alu pipe you used for the arm of each snc5 (in the lower frame) is: 32mm outside pipe and ¿__? mm inside pipe

(2)one of the two alu pipe´s you used to attach the platform of the steering wheel should be ¿__? mm outside and 32mm inside pipe and the other like (1)

(3)you used alu the following alu tubes:
-38*38: 38mm ext. and 32mm inside ... 6mm thickness
-sockets: 50*50: 50mm ext. and 38mm inside ... 12mm thickness
Is this right?
I am having problems to get such tube measures here in Spain, what could be the minimum thickness of each tubes I should use?

(4)You know where I can buy it online?

rgds.

All pipes are the same size: between 31-32mm outside (but closer to 31 mm) and 25 mm inside. Only one short pipes, you mentioned are: 38 mm outside and 31-32 mm inside. With this one i had to sand down smaller pipe to fit inside without restrictions. Is is already around 30 mm.

Sockets are 50 to 50 mm square outside and internal size is 38 mm which means each wall is 6 mm thick. The same with 38 x 38 mm profiles (32 mm inside) - they have all 3 mm each wall thickness.

If that will be really hard to find those sizes just replace them. Find something smaller or bigger. Remember that this construction is strong enough and only conception is important. Everything works on sockets idea - if you can find profiles (even different sizes) which can fit eachother than you are on the right way. Just focus on this: three different sizes of materials - pipe to fit small square profile than this small one to fit bigger square one. After that everything is easier.

This is first video of my simulator. I choose my brother to drive on it, because he`s the best in driving out of track - this way you can see more movements . I`ve used Race On Sim to play and Nima`s (thanks mate) profile. After three minutes you will be able to see simulator from different angle (side and back). Soon i will put more videos. I have few from the back of sim where you can see screen (you will be able to compare: how this match those movements from game).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VsXuxprQtE&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnEyKPFygEk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sauJLyKSQVA

what car were you driving. sounds like a clk 55 amg mercedes when shifting gears.

It`s DODGE CHALLENGER SRT 8 from 2008 6.1 HEMI CUP. Track is KNUTSTORP, SWEDEN.
You can`t really see anything from the game on this video. My point was to show you whole Sim - how it works when you look at him. On others video will be more views from game. I will put them tomorrow (night). I will also post some new pictures of that hand break which i did last time.

You can easy see on the video that whole platform bounce a little bit on the ground - that because of soft carpet. Definitely it would be better on hard surface. When SCN5 pulls top platform down the lower one is going after him (to the top) a little bit. I am sure that this effect will disappear on hard surface - because of stable cross support.

I uploaded another video (above). You can see my simulator from another side and also part of screen. Because i made that video in very bright room then screen looks blurry - thats why i `ve put another one in dark where you can see what i am dealing with.


Preparing myself to Dirt 2 premiere i made addition to simulator - a hand break. Usually i am driving for fun - just making some stupid things with car. Thats why i really like Grid game where you can go crazy and still have sense of reality.
Hand break lever is from Range Rover car. It cames with button on the side. This button works like every button on every hand break - when pressed it`s disconnected when released (lever out of it (UP)) it means current flow through (exactly different way than standard push button). I connect it straight to G25 Wheel going through main shaft to one of buttons on the wheel. It could be easier to connect it to gearbox but i find out that buttons works on PCB board and it will be very hard to find right connection to replace one of this buttons (hard for me ! - you can give it a try). In past i was going to make hand break like one of this works like pedals (for example) but i realized that i will newer use it (like on driving test - to release slowly when you going against hill). In rally car you are using hydraulic cylinder on hand break to get as much force as you can get when you driving - to break tires connection with the ground or disconnect rear differential. Thats why i decided to go easy way. Works perfect - addition in shape of spring gave me really tough feel of real hand break.

That's a nice mod. I'm looking forward to Dirt 2 as well so I may look into adding a hand brake as well. Thanks for sharing.

....Mike

There you go another videos of ..how it works. This time some - GRID stuff....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JA7RrcBRLus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELMsfBlAZ8g


....it is hardly seen but maybe you will find what you want. I mean - some important informations about how accurate it moves.

Hi again Skaudt!
Thx for sharing the videos about your cockpit. I still think your mod is great. I love the idea of having the pedals also integrated in the upper frame ... after watching the videos I now can confirm that driving this mod gives you an impressive inmersion feeling. It would be great if you can post a video recorded from behind the driver where we can see the cockpit + the screen at the same time.
Can´t wait for your next project .)

The most of my fun about driving a car is about g-force, especially when you accelerate!
On every of ours simulators g-force simulation comes from illusion - being pulled to the back. To be more specific - it is just a rocking on a chair.
I am going to do something more, like proper feel of being pressed to the back because of acceleration and throw to front (also pressed closer to steering wheel) when you break.

Basic concept is about to use original seat runners (which are used to adjust yours seat position on the front of wheel). Block or detach lever to get seat move free. Connect extra bottom scn5 to seat.

I already did some tests on runners without connecting them to scn5 and i can say that this is something what i was looking fore. You can really feel like that force kicking you to the back and when i break it is brutally pressing you on the front dashboard.

Still there is lots of questions in my head about making this in real - thats why i am showing you before. Together we can make this works even better.

Thing is that i have to add extra math calculation to get extra scn5 work only with acceleration and deceleration. In this case, when i am replacing movements - i can get the first actuators (from the back) to relive from this movements. Small type of rocking can still stay - it is quite good but the most of this suppose to be depend of bottom actuators.
Since there will be no front & back rocking (at least not that much) there will be no problem with Pivot. Movements to the side will stay the same and front & back will be not depend of the pivot position. BTW we had lots of problems in this case.

Another advantage can be in case of kick to the back when you already speeding. In normal case you just getting small pull to the back when on high speed you will put your foot down. Because of math reading it is like car is still on move - thats why actuators with the seat are still in the same position (to the back) and when you press acceleration it will not change much.
We can set up math calculation more easy (free from others movements) and get theirs work to be depend of drivers seat not because of car.
I really need that kick to the back even when i am speeding 100 m/h. It is like - when turbo is getting his maximum spool and kick you so hard!

I am about to make some improvements to my simulator and i know that this will take some time. Thats why i am showing you some drawings right now - what i am going to do.
First thing is to change that front/back movement with one or two extra scn5. That will be easy since i have already everything prepared. Second thing is about rear arms/scn5 which no longer will be at the back. I am going to put them under seat (bottom construction) and use something like torque lever to transfer force farther to the top frame.

Basically it will be able to work in the same way as it used to be on standard one. Advantages are because of saved space and the most important extra force.
Sim will be smaller without rear arms and more compact.
In case of force it is all about using torque lever. Everybody knows how it works. You are even able to double force by using the same power. It is just a matter of arm extension (length of the arm/lever on one side). Maths are not necessary but i am giving you some formula anyway.