Projekt Flugsimulator

Thats, the point. Since the platform is not square, the long part in the front will be out of the intercection point when moved up and down while banking to the left or right the platform!!

Thats way I suggested to put it on the back that both ends have the same distance from the intercection joint!

Try it with a piece o paper to see it yourself, or better take a closer look on my videos on the joyrider. You will see that the front makes lots of offset motion!

Regards, Thanos

Das sehe ich ja jetzt erst! Du hast das Kreuzgelenk nicht direkt an die Plaform geschweißt. Überlege mal, was nun passiert. Anstatt dass die Platform über den Pivot gekippt wird, wird sie im großen Bogen darüber geschwenkt.

Das Kreuzgelenk muss so nahe wie möglich unter die Platform. Das solltest du ändern. Wenn möglich sogar direkt auf Rahmenhöhe.

The position of the motors in the sketch is ok. But the pivot joint has to be placed directy under the platform. He displaced the joint from center (regarding the height).

das stimmt natürlich. Kleiner Fehler, große Wirkung.

Ich kann das Kreugelenk direkt an das Kreuz an die obere Plattform schweissen, dass sieht dann wohl so aus (schnelle Montage).



Geht das überhaupt, selbst wenn das Kreuzgelenk direkt unter der Plattform ist? In die Plattform selbst kann ich es nicht integrieren, kann nicht so oft ans Schweissgerät (leider). Der direkte Mittelpunkt wird ja so nie 100%ig erreicht?

Auch wird die Plattform niedriger als vorher.
Das wäre mir aber eigentlich ganz recht, da ich sowieso Probleme mit der Raumhöhe wegen der Projektion vom Beamer bekommen hätte.
Bei einer 30° Steigung beispielsweise würde der Beamer schön die halbe Decke anleuchten, soviel will ich gar nicht... Dann sind´s nur noch ca. 15°.


Ok, i think i got it. The joint needs so be directly at the plattform (please look at the edited photo). btw: did you see my idea for the wipermotors?

Die Gesamthöhe der Platform spielt für die Funktion keine Rolle. kannst ja unter dem Gelenk die Höhe verändern.

Nur das Gelenk sollte so nahe wie nur möglich unter, am besten in die Platform.

Es ist wichtig, dass du verstehst warum.

1. Verschiebt sich die Angreifpunkte der Seilanbindungen an der Platform beim bewegen.

2. Wird umso mehr Kraft benötigt, umso weiter die Platform vom Kreuzgelenk entfernt ist.

Was man zur Kompensation tuen kann, da das Kreuzgelenk in deinem Fall nur mit sehr großem Aufwand in die Platform selbst integriert werden kann, ist, dass du an den Punkten, wo die Seile angebracht werden, kleine Ausleger nach unten schweißt, die so lange sind, wie der Abstand vom Kreuzgelenk zur Platform.
Aber das Kreuzgelenk sollte auf jeden Fall zumindest direkt unter die Platform, wenn schon nicht integriert.

Danke! Habe es gerafft

Also, das Kreuzgelenk wird geändert so dass es direkt unter der Plattform ist.
Kleine Ausleger an der Seilanbringung so lang wie der Abstand Kreuzgelenk-Plattform (sprich knapp 7 cm) bring ich an, erscheint mir die einfachste Möglichkeit.

Wäre es eigentlich nicht sinnvoller wenn ich den pitchantrieb hinten am Kreuzpunkt montiere, der Weg der Motoren würde sich ja hier verringern.
Der Kraftaufwand wäre hier allerdings wohl höher..

Its true that I started to mount the cables on open-like loops beneath the joyrider as seen on these photos:



But lots of problems were introduced in this type of connection. First of all the cables were starting loosing their tension when i was sitting in the seat because the pvc pipes bended a little from my weight. Second I faced geat problem to connect the Y axis motion cymbal as it was asymetrical regarding the X axis resulting in obstructed motion when I was trying to move Y axis front or back!

Thats why I constructed the true closed loop pulleys you see now on my joyrider.

I don't know if Tobi's metalic platform will be affected from bending and may be good with cable tension but he should definetely mount the cable connections perfectly symetrical to each other.

I will prepare a schetch of how he should do it properly to help him avoid loosing time... ;-)

Regards, Thanos

@Thanos

Currently the problem is that the platform is too far away from the joint. He is going to fix that (by rewelding the joint).
When this is accomplished, the offset motion will be minimized.
Perhaps I wouldnt recomend to place the y-axis motor on the rear end, because I think the motor wont have enough torque to lift the platform in that case. What do you think?

i´m going to fix the problem tomorrow by welding the joint directly under the plattform.


Yes, i would be very, very pleased if you could make a sketch

Tobi

update

today i fixed the problem.

here are some photos:






next thing is the wipermotors-thing
Maybe thanos can add a sketch

Greets
Tobi

Sehr schön!

Reicht dir die Bewegungsfreiheit? Ich finde unterhalb des Gelenks ist es nun recht kurz

Gruss

ja, da hab ich mir einige Gedanken gemacht.
Wenn´s so läuft dann bin ich überglücklich

Hi Tobi,

Here is my suggestions on how you should mount the wires:



The red pieces are the small extension rods you should use to attach on the the cables to be on the same height with joint rotation point.



On the next concept the mounting is more simple and the results are guarantied!




I would prefer the second one as in that case you can use bus belts that need no tensioning as I did in my joyrider (look into upgrades page).

Its your choice now!

Regards, Thanos

@Thanos

I think mountig the y-axis wires to the front is better, still.

1. By rewelding the joint to the platform, the offset motion have been reduced a lot.

2. I think the leaverage wont be enough to handle the weight with the wipermotors, if mounted on the backside.
The platform construction itself is going to wheigt a lot. Even more with the equipment.

3. The seat will be mounted directly on top of the joint. Placing the wire mount directly behind, the plaform wont be able to move backwards.

What do you think?

regards
Christian

Hi Thanos, hi Ego!

First, thank you very much for your suggestions.

Yes, i prefer the second one, because of:

- more simple to build
- using a busbelt does not need re-tensioning
- the power of the wipermotors will be enough, i´m not sure if it´s
enough on the first suggestion.

I tried to find out if there´s much difference between mounting the y-axis-motor in the back or in the front because i´m still learning.
And wow, there´s a lot
Trying to move the plattform by hand in the front was no problem, but in the back because of the less Leverage i had to use much more power to get it up.

So my thoughts are in the same way like ego, to mount it at the front.
What do you think about it?

The sketch is with 2 motors, don´t you think there´s need for 2 for each side?

Efcharisto!

Tobi

I painted the frame and the plattform today so i couldn´t work on it.

So i thought again about the wipermotors. Comparing the motors of thanos and me made me realize, that it´s not possible to make it 100% same.

The problem is, that the space between wheel and motor fix points is so small. It makes it impossible to place a thin plate in.

So i thought about a solution for it:

This shows the motor with the arm. To get a longer spire i used this:


So i could get the power from the arm and from the motor direct.


Next step is to get the wheel in, it fits. The arm and the mainbolt is connected to the wheel.


Last Step is to mount a plate for the caster wheel .



Do you think that this works? I´m not sure, because the intermediate plate is missing.. Or do i have to get other wipermotors like yours? The time i bought them was to early i think so...

Thanks!

Tobi

In case the leaver isnt made out of cast iron, it shoudlnt be that difficult to tool it to meet your requirements. It shouldn't be a big problem to DIY a new one with hammer, bench vice or ambos anyway

You should fill the space between the leaver and the whell with nuts, in order to enforce the construction.
I think one screw is not enough.

hmm, perhaps this solution could be best. It provides enough space for the seat and enclosure, and provides a little more leaverage.

Hi Ego,

Thats exactly what I was thinking to sketch next!!!! (except ftom the cabin drawing perhaps... )

This will work! As long the two axis cable mount points have the same distance, it will be ok! What the hell, he might be able to use only one motor for each axis this way, since it uses more leverage!!!

@ Tobi: Regarding the motor - pulley mounting... Yes its some times difficult to replicate my all bolts way since your materials are different. In that case you will have to figure out yourself the best way to attach each other in a firm way. Your idea of using caster mechanism to hold back the forces on the other side of pulley are correct. I also did in my setup as tensioning tends to bend the motors axle to braking point!!!

Regards, Thanos


Regards, Thanos

Imho its just important that they are in row with the intersection point. Different distances only affect the individual axis speed and leaverage. It has no effect on functionality

Btw, I added the cabin and seat to show that the motor mount has to be placed a little away from the platform anyway to ensure enough space anyway

regards
Christian